TMBRA - Rider Board

 
 FAQFAQ   SearchSearch   MemberlistMemberlist   UsergroupsUsergroups   RegisterRegister 
 ProfileProfile   Log in to check your private messagesLog in to check your private messages   Log inLog in 

quad cramping....after the fact

 
Post new topic   Reply to topic    TMBRA - Rider Board Forum Index -> Ask the Bike Doc
View previous topic :: View next topic  
Author Message
dannybaggett
New


Joined: 16 Feb 2005
Posts: 42

PostPosted: Thu Feb 17, 2005 6:47 am GMT +0000    Post subject: quad cramping....after the fact Reply with quote

hello doc, i have been off the bike since kelly creek last year, rebuilding the bike trails @ cedar hill state park, and have just started riding again. i have put in a few 30-35 milers. weeellll i was out riding (road) 2 days ago and pused the miles just a little to far i think...anyhoo, i cramped in the left quad...about 5-6 inches above my knee about the 4-5 o'clock position.....to the point of locking up my leg. the muscle rose up and spasmed for about 3-5 minutes...when it calmed down i got back on the bike and finised the ride with no problem....the next day the area was sore to the touch, and this, the 3rd day it's still tender. is this normal...seems like i have cramed in this area before and not been sore the next day....okay to ride? or rest it another day or 2...thanks, and sorry for the ramble.....danny
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Anonymous
Guest





PostPosted: Thu Feb 17, 2005 10:42 am GMT +0000    Post subject: Reply with quote

Danny,

Yes, that is normal for a severe muscle cramp. It is called DOMS (delayed onset muscle soreness). It comes about from eccentric muscle contractions (commonally called a negative) and SEVERE muscle contractions (i.e., cramps). It will get better. The onset of the cramps will lessen as you get back into riding shape. Just don't do too many miles at one time.

A contributing factor was probably dehydration. So, stay well hydrated and ease back into the mileage.

Happy training.

Terry Dupler, Ph.D.
(Exerdoc)
Back to top
The Bike Doc
250+


Joined: 08 May 2003
Posts: 1369
Location: Corpus Christi and Warda, Texas

PostPosted: Thu Feb 17, 2005 3:01 pm GMT +0000    Post subject: Reply with quote

dannybaggett:

Exerdoc is guiding you well. Also consider adding stretching back into your training program. Muscles that are inadequately stretched are more prone to cramps. Let me recommend an excellent book "Stretching" by Bob Anderson. He gives easy to understand therory followed by useful direction and sports specific stretches with excellent illustrations. Daily stretching even when not racing or training does wonders to keep the muscles and joints limber and less prone to injury.

Thanks,
_________________
Paul K. Nolan, MD
AKA: The Bike Doc
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website
dannybaggett
New


Joined: 16 Feb 2005
Posts: 42

PostPosted: Thu Feb 17, 2005 5:13 pm GMT +0000    Post subject: Reply with quote

thanks doc(s). i know i was not hydrated right Embarassed ....didn't realize it was gonna be as hot as it was, and knew i had pushed the miles more than i should have....i'll start the stretching again, i need to get the book, or look at it, cuz i can't find a ggooodd strech for that particular muscle....sure did look freaky jumping around like it was....oh well, lesson learned.
thanks again, danny
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
khighfield
250+


Joined: 22 Sep 2004
Posts: 1180
Location: Houston

PostPosted: Sun Feb 20, 2005 2:07 pm GMT +0000    Post subject: Reply with quote

A timely topic thread this, since I have just returned from Terlingua. I experienced bad thigh cramps near the top of Tres Cuevas, nothing too surprising there, I suppose, having already raced hard for 25 miles, but I seem to experience leg cramps more than most. My leg strength is fairly good now, I was well hydrated, ates lots of bananas before the race and I did a ton of goo, but still cramped.

A fellow rider told me that Calcium is an important factor in delivering the carbs and potassium where needed, and some folks take calcium supplements before racing, even Tums can help.

Any advice on this subject?

Thanks
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail
dannybaggett
New


Joined: 16 Feb 2005
Posts: 42

PostPosted: Sun Feb 20, 2005 4:45 pm GMT +0000    Post subject: Reply with quote

Cool tums ex helps if everything you're doing is right....i start taking them about an hour into a ride then one to two per hour after that as needed...
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Anonymous
Guest





PostPosted: Mon Feb 21, 2005 6:06 am GMT +0000    Post subject: Reply with quote

If your cramping and doing all the things you mentioned (plenty of h20, carbs, other electrolytes?), then my educated guess would be that you're missing magnesium. It has been shown that "habitual" crampers needed more mg due to a larger rate of loss. So, your next step is to try a mg supplement.

The best one I've tried is the liquid one you put in your water bottle.

good luck

TD
Back to top
dannybaggett
New


Joined: 16 Feb 2005
Posts: 42

PostPosted: Mon Feb 21, 2005 6:40 pm GMT +0000    Post subject: Reply with quote

cool, i didn't know about that one......i'll have to try that as well....
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
The Bike Doc
250+


Joined: 08 May 2003
Posts: 1369
Location: Corpus Christi and Warda, Texas

PostPosted: Tue Feb 22, 2005 7:02 am GMT +0000    Post subject: Be cautious with magnesium supplimentation Reply with quote

There can be too much of a good thing. If someone reads this and thinks "Great I can suppliment with magnesium to stop leg cramps" and gets too much magnesium, there are some rather unpleasant side effects: diarrhea thereby increasing risks of dehydration and cramping from electrolyte/fluid loss, muscle weakness, low blood pressure, slowed heart rate, slowed reflexes and skin damage with prolonged use. Do not exceed 350 mg per day. It would be wisest to have a serum magnesium level checked before starting supplimentation as most individuals have addequate intake of magnesium in their diets and do not need supplimentation.

Thanks,
_________________
Paul K. Nolan, MD
AKA: The Bike Doc
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website
khighfield
250+


Joined: 22 Sep 2004
Posts: 1180
Location: Houston

PostPosted: Tue Feb 22, 2005 2:50 pm GMT +0000    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thanks for all the very useful advice. I'm seeing my own Doc next week on an unrelated matter, so I'll speak to him about this subject. Noted the sensible warning from BikeDoc - there is no magic bullet is there?

Kevin
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail
Anonymous
Guest





PostPosted: Wed Feb 23, 2005 8:54 am GMT +0000    Post subject: Reply with quote

Doc Nolan is 100% correct. Let me re-state so the info on the forum is really understood.

Only about 1 - 2% of all endurance athletes "need" the mg supplementation. They only need it due to a larger rate of loss during exercise. These are the people who cramp EVERY time (or almost every time) they bike, run, etc.

So, 98 - 99% of the athletes reading this forum do not need mg supplementation.

Terry Dupler, Ph.D.
Back to top
dannybaggett
New


Joined: 16 Feb 2005
Posts: 42

PostPosted: Wed Feb 23, 2005 5:11 pm GMT +0000    Post subject: Reply with quote

gotcha...haven't cramped since then annyhoo....ramping up the miles 10% a ride not 20% a ride....
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Jhowell
New


Joined: 09 Jul 2003
Posts: 78

PostPosted: Wed Feb 22, 2006 9:09 am GMT +0000    Post subject: Cramps?? Reply with quote

I've been taking one or two "Tums" before a race to reduce if not prevent cramps. I always thought it was working - it's good to have that validated.

At Terlingua I mentioned mild cramping (despite Tums) after the first lap & a friend gave me pill that had salt and potassium in it. Seemed to help out since my attention turned to trying to find the proper balance of water intake, Accelerade and Cliff Shots on the second lap.

So, the questions are:
a. was the salt/potassium capsule appropriate
b. what is the proper balance of water, accelerade, and Cliff Shots
c. why are those guys that are 40 years younger so much faster than me.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
The Bike Doc
250+


Joined: 08 May 2003
Posts: 1369
Location: Corpus Christi and Warda, Texas

PostPosted: Thu Feb 23, 2006 5:28 am GMT +0000    Post subject: Re: Cramps?? Reply with quote

Jhowell wrote:
I've been taking one or two "Tums" before a race to reduce if not prevent cramps. I always thought it was working - it's good to have that validated.

At Terlingua I mentioned mild cramping (despite Tums) after the first lap & a friend gave me pill that had salt and potassium in it. Seemed to help out since my attention turned to trying to find the proper balance of water intake, Accelerade and Cliff Shots on the second lap.

So, the questions are:
a. was the salt/potassium capsule appropriate
b. what is the proper balance of water, accelerade, and Cliff Shots
c. why are those guys that are 40 years younger so much faster than me.


jhowell:
Forgive me if I sound like a politician
a. Maybe. If you were down on both potasium and chloride then the salt/potassium capsule may have been appropriate, PROVIDED sufficient water was taken with it. Most sports docs do not recommend taking salt tablets/capsules but instead to consume sports drinks with the salt and potasium already in. This insures addequate water intake to avoid dangerous excessesively high salt levels while still dehydrated.

b. It depends on your individual sweat losses. Check your weight (in the buff is best) prework out or race and again immediately afterwards. For every pound you are down post workout or race, you were deficient in your fluid replacement by 16 ounces. So if you drank one quart (32 ounces) of fluid while racing and you are down two pounds at the end, you need to increase your fluid intake 32 ounces more on top of the 32 ounces you consumed while racing. Conditioned athletes can loose up to 2 quarts of sweat an hour. I recommend using a sport drink such as Gatorade or Accelerade for your replacement fluid instead of plain water to get the best ballance of salt, potasium and water intake. Cliff Shots provide extra calories that are needed during an endurance event. I recommend taking them over and above your sport drink fluid intake. You will need to experiment to find out what your tolerances are for Cliff Shots while taking a sport drink. You may find that one an hour is your limit or you may even beable to consume as much as three an hour.

Now my personal take on ALL energy gels that come in foil packs: DON'T USE THEM! After picking up over 600!!!! packets after a race in Warda, I banned sponsors from distributing free packets at the ranch. We still get loads of foil packs on the trails after every race. You may never have been one of those who dumps the packets on the trail but think about waste and recycling issues. Get a refillable squeeze flask and use it for your energy gels. (Sorry, this is one of my HOT buttons!!! Mad )

c. Damned if I know!

Thanks,
_________________
Paul K. Nolan, MD
AKA: The Bike Doc
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website
Display posts from previous:   
Post new topic   Reply to topic    TMBRA - Rider Board Forum Index -> Ask the Bike Doc All times are GMT - 6 Hours
Page 1 of 1

 
Jump to:  
You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum


Powered by phpBB © 2001, 2005 phpBB Group